The Two Marketeers Podcast

Mastery of More Ideas

In April 2024, Contagious sent out its weekly newsletter, the 'Contagious Edit: Your Weekly Dose of Contagious Thinking,' which immediately caught the eye of The Two Marketeers as it discussed the virtues of churning stuff out.

The newsletter states, "In his 2018 book, Atomic Habits, James Clear tells a story about a photography teacher that holds a useful lesson for creative types.

Clear had come by the story in another book, called Art & Fear, which was published in 1985. The authors of that work had — for not especially interesting reasons — obscured the truth of the tale by omitting the name of the teacher in question and changing the locale to a ceramics class. But after Clear got in touch with them — and then spoke with some of the teacher’s former students — he learned the facts behind the fable, and this is apparently how it really happened.

Jerry Uelsmann was a successful artist who taught a film photography class at the University of Florida. On the first day of class one year, Uelsmann divided his students into two groups. He told the first group that they would be the ‘quantity’ group, and he would grade them on how many photos they submitted by the end of term. The other group, he said, was the ‘quality’ group, and they only had to produce one photograph all semester, but it had to be near-perfect to earn an A.

When it came time for Uelsmann to review his students’ photographs, he saw that the best compositions almost all came from the quantity group. While the students in the quality group had fussed over one or a few pictures, the quantity group were clicking away like an arthritic ankle in winter, and apparently became better photographers for it.

Former psychology professor Dean Keith Simonton spent decades studying human greatness in art and science, and he also found that, when it comes to creative endeavours, there is great value in volume.

After researching the lives of more than 2,000 eminent scientists, Simonton told the LA Times in 1988 that the single most important quality these great thinkers shared was probably ‘the willingness to produce a tremendous amount of work — often on seemingly trivial or useless projects — without fear of failure.’

In 1997 Simonton published a paper that articulated this finding as the ‘equal-odds rule’, which states that ‘the relationship between the number of hits (ie, creative successes) and the total number of works produced in a given time period is positive, linear, stochastic, and stable.’

The relationship between quality and quantity is not written in stone. A 2008 paper by Aaron Kozbelt, for example, found that classical composers produced their greatest concentration of hit songs around five years after their productivity peak, which suggests things like experience and expertise have a role to play. And common sense would suggest that you have to pay at least some attention to the quality of your ideas and compositions to eventually hit paydirt.

Still, it’s a fairly reliable rule of thumb that you need to have a lot of ideas to have great ones."

Join The Two Marketeers in this episode as they debate the quality vs. quantity of ideas and how to become a master of more. Happy listening!

What Happened to the Brief?

Welcome to a less-than-brief conversation all about the brief! As creative strategy people in the marketing and advertising industry, The Two Marketeers co-hosts, Sean Patrick and Lindsay Waugh, are obsessed with the brief. And rightfully so! The brief is the kick-off to brilliant (and, unfortunately, mediocre) work. But, it should NOT be the beginning of the work being done. In this episode, Sean and Lindsay discuss and debate the role of the brief, all that has to go into creating one, and what to do in the absence of a great one, or let's be real, one at all. 

Happy listening, Marketeers! Then, get out there and craft better briefs. 

For reference: 

MarketingWeek, "Mark Ritson: The idea that marketers need to be creative is a load of baloney, we’re useless at it."

Is AI Going to Take Our Jobs?

Watch out, The Two Marketeers are fired up! Co-hosts Sean Patrick and Lindsay Waugh take this episode to unpack a controversial article published in CMSWire with the headline, "AI Will Replace 95% of Creative Marketing Work". And as you may imagine, Sean and Lindsay call BS.

The article, linked below, starts by stating, "Goodbye, marketing. Hello, AI. Or AGI. OK, that's totally dramatic. But it's kinda what a top executive in the generative AI space says. Sam Altman, CEO of OpenAI, the creator of ChatGPT, says in the new book, "Our AI Journey" that AI will mean that 95% of what marketers use agencies, strategists, and creative professionals for today will easily, nearly instantly and at almost no cost be handled by the AI — and the AI will likely be able to test the creative against real or synthetic customer focus groups for predicting results and optimizing. Again, all free, instant, and nearly perfect. Images, videos, campaign ideas? No problem."

As with any new technology birthed into the world, it begins with collective excitement and intrigue, quickly followed by the fear that, once again, technology is set to take over the world and make us all unemployable. As Lindsay so eloquently states, bologna.

Tune into this lively discussion with The Two Marketeers as they debate and discuss the role of AI, what it is good for and what human elements it cannot replace-at least today.

For reference:

CMSWire > "Sam Altman: AI Will Replace 95% of Creative Marketing Work"

Pushing Creative Process Over Creative People

In this episode of The Two Marketeers, co-hosts Sean Patrick and Lindsay Waugh dive into a recent article from Ad Age that sheds light on a critical shift in the advertising industry. Agencies are increasingly pressured to sell their cookie-cutter proprietary processes over their people, talent and creative chops. Sean and Lindsay unpack the why behind this trend and its implications, discussing its impact on agency culture, creativity, and client relationships.

Sean and Lindsay offer insightful advice to agencies facing this challenge, suggesting that while having a process to sell is important, it's crucial to look at the bigger picture. They strongly (ha!) advocate for agencies to change the narrative about what best-in-class agency talent looks like. Instead of focusing solely on processes, agencies should prioritize getting the right people (as full-time or contract resources) and creative capabilities, emphasizing the collective value they bring to clients beyond a one-page process.

Join Sean and Lindsay as they explore how agencies can adapt to this changing landscape, redefine their value and how they make choices (and money!) for the future of the ad industry. 

For reference: 

Ad Age, "Why Agencies are Obsessed with Pitching on Process Instead of Talent"